#150 - If You Aren’t Doing It, It's Not Doable

Hi, do you keep telling yourself, “I know what to do, I just need to actually do it?” Welcome. 

In this episode, Emily and Tiffany unpack a hard (and oddly relieving) truth: when something isn’t happening, it’s usually a design problem, not a motivation problem. More effort, more discipline, or more information won’t fix a plan that doesn’t fit real life.

From nail trims and walks to client plans, business routines, and professional growth, Emily and Tiffany talk about why you shouldn’t be trying harder; instead, try different. The goal isn’t doing less because you care less. It’s designing systems that are actually doable, for real humans, real pets, and real lives.

TLDL (too long, didn’t listen): 3 Key Takeaways 

1️⃣ If you aren’t doing it, that’s data – It’s not a character flaw. Inconsistent follow-through usually means the plan doesn’t fit your reality. Shame won’t fix that, but redesigning might.

2️⃣ Fit your plans to life, not life to the plan – When we stop designing for an ideal world and start designing for the one we’re actually living in, progress gets a lot more accessible.

3️⃣ Doing less doesn’t mean you care less – Just because something is simple, smooth, and easy, doesn’t mean you care less, or aren’t doing enough.

For the full episode show notes, including the resources mentioned in this episode, go here.

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Transcript

[00:00:00] Emily: this belief that like if I cared enough, I would make it happened. Or if I was disciplined enough, I would be able to pull this off. That is a myth that is not true. The truth is no matter how much you care, if it's not doable, hearing more is not going to fix it. If it's not doable, more discipline is not going to fix it. 

[00:00:27] Allie: Welcome to Enrichment for the Real World, the podcast devoted to improving the quality of life of pets and their people through enrichment. We are your hosts, Allie Bender...

[00:00:37] Emily: ...and I'm Emily Strong...

[00:00:38] Allie: ...and we are here to challenge and expand your view of what enrichment is, what enrichment can be and what enrichment can do for you and the animals in your lives. Let's get started.

Thank you for joining us for today's episode of Enrichment for the Real World, and I want to thank you for rating, reviewing, and subscribing wherever you listen to podcasts. 

[00:00:58] Emily: I'm gonna, I'm gonna ask you a question, Tiffany, that I'm really asking everybody, but I'm gonna ask you because you're here and you can answer me. All right, here we go. How many times have you said, I know what I should be doing, I just need to actually do it.

Same. I use this app called Finch to like, help me keep track of all my, like self-care habits that keep me, organized, put together, help me meet my needs, stay on track with my self enrichment plan, all of that stuff. And there have been so many times in using that app that. There's just like one task that I just keep skipping and skipping and skipping, and after a while, I mean, it takes me an embarrassingly long time to realize if I keep skipping this, it means what I'm expecting of myself isn't working, and I need to adjust to my plan.

[00:01:51] Tiffany: Yeah, and for me it's like anything that's, anything that's not actually for me is what ends up being prioritized. If it's for pd, if it's for Nathan, if it's for my household. Those are the things like even if I don't want to do them, that I will do even over something that I do want to do or me.

[00:02:20] Emily: Yeah. Yeah. That's real. I also have not been able to do things for my pets, my partner, my household at times when I'm having, like, when one of my health issues is, is going hard or when I'm working extra hours for work or when, we've had like routine disruptions because life stuff is happening.

So I, I feel like this also applies to caring for things and people and objects and sentient beings other than myself. But I agree with you that the stuff that I do for myself definitely gets the, the lowest priority I think that's also true for things like your pets enrichment plan.

It's, it's not just about us, but like. Oftentimes we neglect ourselves more than we neglect others, right? But it can also apply to your pet's enrichment plan, or if you're a behavior professional, it can apply to your client's ability to follow through with the plan you give them. Or if you run your own business, it can apply to how you run your business and your routines and the goals you've set for yourself and the policies you've crafted for yourself or your business or your team or whatever.

But I think the bottom line, the, the through line, through all of those examples is if you aren't doing it, it's probably not doable. And that has been a really hard lesson for me to learn, and I'm still learning it, and I suspect I'm not anywhere close to being the only one. I think this is a really common thing that we struggle with.

So today we're gonna talk about why trying harder isn't the answer. It's about try trying different 

[00:04:10] Tiffany: Never try harder.

[00:04:11] Emily: never try harder throw no pain, no gain out the window. But how trying different can actually make behavior change more sustainable for both you and the learners in your care. Whether those learners are your own pets, your kids, your clients, your client's pets, your employees, whoever.

This is important whether like regardless of who you are and who the learners in your care are, right? Whether you're a pet parent who's overwhelmed by what you feel you have to do to meet their needs, or a professional who feels overwhelmed because. It feels like just a ton of clients are struggle busting with the plans you've given them or whether it's your business and you're just struggle busting to get your team on board.

We all hit that point where reality doesn't match the plan and instead of blaming the effort, like you're not trying hard enough, we need to talk about designing for doable. So hopefully by the end of this episode we'll know how to recognize when something isn't workable and how to creatively redesign plans that fit your real life and how to help your clients and yourself shift from that sort of like quote unquote capital T training mindset that we've referenced in future episodes.

And we can definitely link those in the show notes to, you know what? Everyday integrated learning that is sustainable and accessible actually looks like.

[00:05:40] Tiffany: Good. Let's figure this out for me. Cutting my dog's nails. He's currently got. 

[00:05:47] Emily: That is real because it took an embarrassingly long time for me to figure out that the solution for copper was just to get some happy meds, happy drugs from my vet, and for Miley, even though she's not nearly as averse to it as copper is because she has opinions about people touching her toenails.

It's about me being like, I, I just, I'm gonna, I'm going to maintain. The, the rule for myself that it's just I'm doing one nail a day for her. I'm not gonna try to sneak in more nails because when I try to sneak in more nails, she's like, I don't wanna do this. This is boring. And then the next day she's like, we did this so much yesterday.

So like, I need to like do less so that I can do more. And then also, like one of the things I mentioned in a, in a recent episode that I feel like I'm not, I, I have enrichment guilt about Kaya and Bundini. And one of the biggest things that I have that guilt about is that I don't do their nails nearly as much as I should because apparently I have capacity to pay attention to two animals, nails, and that's the end of my capacity.

[00:07:04] Tiffany: Once everybody gotta have so many nails.

[00:07:07] Emily: Why? Yes. Why 

do we have to have nails?

[00:07:11] Tiffany: The problem for me is that like I have a really good system when it's warm outside because he can play with the hose and then it's like, okay, break time, gimme your feet. And I just clip, clip, clip, clip, and I clip his nails while he is taking a break.

Like, okay, get it. And we get the hose and we just do that. But like it's six degrees or something with the wind chill, like one, once it's cold, I can't, I can't do that. And I don't have any kind of stand in activity because like he doesn't, he doesn't care about like a flirt pole or he doesn't care about anything the way he cares about the hose.

And so it's a more time consuming thing and like, yes he knows how to do the scratch board and stuff, but he. I don't know. It must not be like that enjoyable for him because he just like throw, he like throws his foot up there like sideways and so he ends up like sharpening his nails.

And it takes a lot longer. It's so fast with the hose. And so like, we're just in talent season in my house and every time he is like, clickety clicking around, I'm like

[00:08:24] Emily: Yeah. The sound has become aversive because it represents for you like enrichment, guilt. Yeah. I feel like you need to get a snowblower. And so in the winter you're like playing the hose game with the snowblower instead of water.

[00:08:38] Tiffany: I just, I haven't figured out anything that would be that exciting for him. So.

[00:08:45] Emily: Yeah. It's, yeah. I, nails are my least favorite things about animals because they require so much maintenance. 

[00:08:52] Tiffany: Too many manicures. 

[00:08:54] Emily: too many manicures. So. So we just, we just, that was a really good example of like a thing that obviously what we're doing isn't, is what our expectations for ourself are unrealistic.

And so instead of just trying to like try harder to do what clearly is not working, now, you and I are both on a mission to find, to try different, to

try something else. 

[00:09:20] Tiffany: I need To try different. That is the case. Yes.

[00:09:24] Emily: And I think that's like a really common thing is people are, I mean, because we were all raised, I mean, I can't say all because I have no concept of how younger generations were raised, but if you were a kid in the eighties, no pain, no gain was drilled into your very mitochondria.

Like it was just drilled from every corner of society into 

every fiber of your being. it's in our DNA, like, just like no pain, no gain, like you've gotta work, it's gotta be hard. You've gotta like have the discipline to like push through the pain and that's not a viable model. Also, it teaches you how to ignore your own needs, which that's gone really well for us as a society.

So, so you know, we have this like voice in our head that came from a lifetime of social conditioning that tells us we just need to be better at scheduling. We need to be more disciplined. We need to buy another planner. If we can just like figure out what's wrong with us, we'll finally like be able to do all the things.

But the reality is if it's not happening, it's probably not possible within your current circumstances. So this turns into. If only I could figure out what was wrong with me, everything would be better. But that I'm like, what happens instead of us all getting better is that we blame ourselves. We get caught in a shame loop, which creates avoidance. Shame sometimes is a motivator for people, but I think more often than not, shame is a de-motivator and it creates avoidance or defensiveness, right?

It leads to burnout, it leads to frustration, it leads to helplessness. All of these things that are really, really common for so many people come from this like try hard mentality, right? So, so like, let's stop doing that because it's terrible and it's miserable and it, and it's not, it's clearly not a working model.

So I'll, I'll, I'll give a couple of examples 'cause you and I talked about like nail trimming stuff for us, and I bet you have some examples of like, stuff with clients or mentees or whatever. But I'll give a couple examples first that I, like, I can think of right off the top of my head, one of my favorites that's like a welcome to Tuesday situation is when clients are like, we just keep trying to get our dog to be okay with us, like taking food out of their mouths or taking toy outta their mouths.

And, and we just keep ending up in conflict. And I'm like, have you ever considered like not doing that? Like, what happens if you just don't try to always steal things from your dog? And they're like, you fixed it. Like we don't, we don't. Sessions because we just stopped stealing things from our dog and suddenly the conflict went away.

It's like, yeah, you don't need to try harder. You don't need a capital T training plan. You just need to try something different. And I think that is such a con, I can't tell you how many clients I only had one session with because the solution was, stop trying so hard to do a thing that's like clearly dysfunctional.

And what's, and here's what's hilarious about it. Here's my second example. When I was, the first time I was in physical therapy, I was like, when I straighten out my elbow like this, it hurts. And, And, my physical therapist was like, have you considered not hyper flexing your elbow? Like, what? How about don't HyperFlex, that's not the way the joint's supposed to go.

Like, what if you 

just stopped doing that? 

[00:13:07] Tiffany: That's hyper 

extension. 

[00:13:09] Emily: Oh, sorry. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Yes, you're right. Have you Yes. Have you stopped hyperextending your elbow? Like how about you just stop doing that and it'll stop hurting? And I, and I just like looked at, I like stared blankly for like probably 10 seconds and then I was like, you say this to my clients all the time, 

[00:13:29] Tiffany: Well, with something like that, especially if you are hypermobile, sorry, to get, not even remotely into dogs, but like, you, you have proprioceptive issues or like your body just does that and so somebody saying just don't do that. While it might be like an aha kind of moment, it's also like, well, are you gonna show me how not to do that?

Because apparently I don't know how not to do that.

[00:13:58] Emily: for sure. And and to her credit, she was a very good pt. So the rest of the conversation was. What you should do instead. But for the purposes of this story, like I, that was the moment when I realized that I was doing the same thing to my PT or not doing something to my pt, but I was asking the same kind of question to my PT that so many clients ask me.

So like, those are my two very simple examples of like, try different instead of try harder. What about you? What are some that you can think of?

[00:14:32] Tiffany: The big one that I always think of is like, especially in like a group class where people are talking about how miserable their walks are because they have, really young dogs and they're just getting pulled all over the place and they're trying, well, I stop and I, wait until they stop pulling and this and that, and it's like. Is that enjoyable? How is that working for you? How is your dog when you get home? Well, they seem really frustrated, like, well, that, that does sound frustrating. Have you tried not doing, have you tried getting a longer leash? You Have, a yark? Do you have to walk right now?

[00:15:08] Emily: right, and again, just like with this, the PT story, there's more to the plan than just have you tried not doing that anymore? But the, the part that is exactly, like my example with the PT is that like you, the reason that you're frustrated with what you're trying is be because what you're trying, isn't it?

It's not the solution. And I think that I think those are really good examples of, of simple, simple fixes, but to be fair to literally everybody, ourselves included, a lot of times it is much less simple than, have you tried not hyperextending your elbow or have you tried not stealing stuff from your dog?

And I think one of the common ones that I and I'm sure you also encounter this a lot when we're working with mentees and PET Pro, is that somewhere in their education they learned that there are these basic skills that dogs need to learn before we address whatever issues the client came to us for.

And I've seen so, so, so, so, so many training plans that are like the dog has to learn hands targeting and down and place. Sit and all, all of these things that are considered like foundational skills that they have to learn before. And they're like my client won't train my, I just can't get my clients to train these 16 behaviors.

And the question is like, well, why do you need your clients to train those 16 behaviors? 

[00:16:47] Tiffany: Yeah, what are you trying to get them to do? 

[00:16:49] Emily: What, what is, what is the desired outcome from that? How does that relate to your client's goals or un the unmet needs? And as because you also mentor and pet pro, the answer is almost always it doesn't.

And so it's like, okay, let's stop trying so hard to get clients to do so much effort for something that we're just doing because we've been told at some point that it should be done, not because it in any way relates to what's actually happening in this situation. So stop trying harder to make your clients do a bunch of work, try something different that is much less labor for both you and your client.

[00:17:28] Tiffany: They got enough work to do.

[00:17:29] Emily: Yeah. We've all got enough work to do. Like we're all stressed and overworked and overwhelmed and all of those things, right? The fatigue is deep, deep, deep down in our bones. And so, asking them to do more is, is usually not the answer. Instead of, try harder, we need to try different, right?

And that also applies to things like business growth and like, are we doing, are we, are, are we doing these things because a business course told us we have to do them? Or are we doing these things because that's actually what our business needs? I think a, an example of that is so many people in PET Pro believe that they have to have a social media marketing strategy, or they have to have a subscription model, or they have to have a Facebook group.

And I'm, I keep telling people, I don't know where y'all got this idea, but like, you don't need those things. You, your individual business may need, that may be a, a strategy that works for your individual business, but we have to assess whether or not that's true. Instead of you having been told that that's true and doing it without assessing whether or not that's actually the path forward for you and your business.

Right.

[00:18:56] Tiffany: What does your data say? 

[00:18:58] Emily: Yeah. Well, data, but I think before we even talk about data, what are your goals say, who is your ICA? Where are they going to find you? What services are you offering? Most of the time, sorry, I just used the term ICA without defining it. Who is your ideal client avatar? Like who? Who is? Who is your ideal or desired audience that you're trying to reach?

Where are you going to reach them? What services are you going to offer them? Social media marketing is not always the solution for reaching those goals. And then, yeah, after you try something, then you let the DA data tell you, is that it or not? Is it working?

[00:19:40] Tiffany: Well,

and I think especially with Pet Pro folks, it's like. I don't know. More complicated is better, or fancier is better, or flashier is better. And so they'll wait until, I don't know, until things are perfect, but like you never think your own things are perfect anyway. Like, for example, just like if they don't have a website, get getting

your, your website set up and they'll just wait and wait and wait to like get everything. Just so, and it's like, do people know that you exist as a business? Do they know where you are? Do they know what you do? Could you maybe just make a landing page so that that information is out there and then you can. Then you can tweak it and then you can make it prettier or better or whatever, or

[00:20:38] Emily: Yes. Yeah, exactly. And again, to be clear, like I, we are not criticizing anybody in the mentorship program any more than we're criticizing ourselves for our own learning journey. We're all getting this information from somewhere, and the information that we got that made us feel inferior and like we have to do all of these things is the thing that's being critiqued, not the people who are victims of that social conditioning.

[00:21:07] Tiffany: No, they're all absolutely the best.

[00:21:11] Emily: yeah. Our, our mentees are the best. And I love them so much. I love working with them. I am 

[00:21:17] Tiffany: They are perfect just the way they are. That's what I'm saying. 

[00:21:22] Emily: That's exactly it. I love, I love my mentees. I love people that aren't my mentees. I love your mentees. I love the people that are in Pet Pro.

And they're amazing. They amaze me all the time at their talents and their ideas and their backgrounds and, and everything that they bring to the table is amazing. And so I feel Mama Bear Protective, parent Bear Protective about like the things that they have been told that make them feel like they're not good enough.

That what they're doing, they're not working hard enough, that they're not. Capable that they just need to try harder. And if they tried harder and had more discipline, everything would be easier. All of that stuff is my concern for them, not my critiques of them. 

[00:22:07] Tiffany: Baren Stain Bear Protective.

[00:22:09] Emily: Berenstein, bear protective. Yeah, and I think like this also, speaking of professional development, like this also applies to self-improvement. It like, if your strategy for improving your skills isn't sustainable, again, it's not you, it's the system you're operating in. And that's I, I feel that so hard because I'm like, oh, I need to get better at this.

I need to get better at this. I need to get better at this. I need to get better at this. And it's like, yes, skill development is important and also. There's just a hard limit as to how much growing we can do. And I, I remember saying this way, way back when the podcast was new and I was, I've been thinking about this over the past few days, a lot.

I need to like write it on my mirror or something because I need to be reminded of this. You're not supposed to constantly grow you like, just like when we actually, when our bodies grow, you have a growth spurt. You get lean and then you pause growing for a while and you just exist in your current capabilities and you get stronger and more stable and more flushed out at, at your current ability place wherever you are.

And then you have another growth spurt and you get long and lean again. And I think what happens with me and. I, I have seen this happen with other people too, not just me, is like, there's a very fine line between having a growth mindset and growing so fast that you are depleting yourself and you can't keep up with your own growth.

[00:23:51] Tiffany: Well, And you have to have time to practice too, right. Like it can't just be study, study, study, whatever. Like you have to have the like where you're just. Practicing like yoga, you always just practice.

[00:24:07] Emily: And I think that really, really impacts our profession even more than the average profession, because since there isn't. Very clear and codified path into this profession, which is not entirely bad. There are pros and cons to that. I think we have the potential to create a new model for what professional development can look like and what entry into a profession can look like.

And we can like avoid a lot of the gatekeeping that happens in other professions. So it's not entirely a bad thing, but the byproduct of not having a clear and codified entry into the profession is that we see people binge and binge and binge and binge continue education because they just think they need more of it to get, get good enough or to feel like they're good enough.

And the thing is, when you are binging and binging and binging, you're not giving yourself the time to do that practice and practice and practice so that the things that you're learning in theory. Have a chance to percolate and sink into your very soul and become muscle memory, and you don't, you're not giving yourself the opportunity to gain fluency.

And so the reason that you constantly feel like you're never taking enough continuing education to feel confident is because you're taking too much and you need to slow down and just really focus on refining what you've already learned instead of trying to learn more. And essentially that is one of the main goals of Pet Pro, is to give people the space to do that in a safe and supportive way where they can get the entire, like all four components of learning to competency in a safe and supportive space.

But there's not, there's not enough of that in this profession. There's not enough of like, okay, you learned, you took this course, you learned this concept. Now let's focus on just letting this percolate and. And generalize and become fluent.

[00:26:12] Tiffany: The other thing is it's gonna like congeal with all of the other things that, you know. So like, the only way that I figured out that I can just clip all of Pete's nails when he's going after the hose is that like he needs to take a break, and he, he will just stand still and take a break and he like, he's gross.

He like licks the hose like he's making out with it. He's disgusting. And like even though he is a really sensitive dog and he is sensitive about being touched for whatever reason, when, when he is doing something that he is so excited about, he's more. I don't know, amenable to like his personal bubble, like being invaded. And so I had tried a lot of other way and we'd done a lot of cooperative care together, but like, I also know that he gets, I don't know what else to call it, but like bored, kinda like you were talking about with Miley, you can only do one or two nails

and then she's like, I, I'm done with this.

That's

like kind of what he's like with training and stuff too,

but he doesn't get tired of the hose. 

So I, I had to like

put together a lot of pieces before I figured that out. And now I also need to, try something different. To get those pieces settled for for the winter, the winter trimming.

[00:27:50] Emily: Yeah. Yeah. And different can look like a lot of things, like different, can look like a different technique. It can look like a different schedule. It can look like different expectations. It can look, trying different, can look like a lot of different things.

[00:28:03] Tiffany: It could just be different expectations on myself too.

[00:28:05] Emily: Yeah. Yeah. I, I will say that like we, when we figured out that that coppers, paraparesis was a side effect of a medication that he was on and not spinal cancer. And he started to improve and we got him a help him, a harness, and he improved enough that we could start going on walks again.

The nail trimming issue became less urgent because just being able to take him on walks again helped, like being on that asphalt really slowed the growth of his nails, right? And we still do the Happy Meds to do like a full mani-pedi, but we only have to do that like once a month now because he gets regular walk walks on the asphalt.

And so I think that is like a really good example of trying different, because the solution to the nail thing was partially the meds, but it was partially figuring out something that seemed totally unrelated to the nails, but was in fact a huge contributing factor. And so sometimes it, it really looks like thinking outside the box or scaling back and looking at the bigger picture, which is why an enrichment framework is so important because it helps you look at the bigger picture and see how all of these things are interconnected that you may not have otherwise, where, where you may not have otherwise connected those dots.

Right.

So I think like, again, one of the reasons that our book and our podcast have in the real world in the title is because one of the things that we strive for and care about a lot is designing plans that are built around reality, not in spite of reality, like. We're not gonna design a plan that's like, if only we could X, Y, Z, we could do this.

And it's like, well that's great, but that if only doesn't exist. This is your reality. This is the real world that you're operating in. So what is the plan that's going to actually work for your real world situation? And that is what trying different looks like, right? Yes. If only you had more bandwidth and energy and cognitive capacity and all, like all of these things, you could do so much more.

You are correct. If only I could lift a thousand more pounds and I could fly, I would be super person. Like, that's not reality though. So that's not what we're gonna try for.

So I think that like, a good sort of like framework to put around it is like, great, if only you could use the hose, the nail trim thing would be so much easy. But that's not your reality for half the year. So what, what does, what does it look like? What does the plan look like? And I'm the same way with Miley.

If only I could just convince her that hanging out for like three or four or five nails at a time was, was interesting to her. We could, I could just do her nails once a week, but that's not her reality. It doesn't matter how high value the food is. She's not a dog who is interested in hanging out for more than like one toenail.

Or sometimes I can get two toenails out of it at a time. And then she's like, cool, let's move on to something else. And to your point, Tiffany, one of my favorite dogs from the sanctuary where Ally and I worked. His name was Milo, and he had this very strict rule in his head that we could do five trials of whatever we were working on and that he was done.

And if I tried to offer, ask him to do the same behavior for a sixth time, he would stare at me and he would literally stomp his hind right foot, like, I'm not gonna do this again. We've already done this five times, so working with him looks like we're gonna do five reps of this, and then we're gonna move on and we're gonna work on five reps of something else, and then we're gonna move on.

And I found it absolutely delightful that he would just stare me down and stomp his foot and be like, no, I've already done this three times. Why do you need me to do it six times? That's delightful. Thank you for giving me that feedback. We can work with that. 

[00:32:30] Tiffany: Yeah, I think, I think what I need to figure out is what will be a satisfying conclusion for me if like we start doing this more often, what is going to satisfy me?

[00:32:47] Emily: Yeah. Well, I, for me, I probably for Miley, I'm actually in like talking this out with you, man. I'm so glad we're doing this podcast episode because it's forcing me to think this through more, more mindfully. But I think for me, I might need to just lower my expectations because her nails aren't terrible.

We go on big, long adventure walks. She digs in the yard. I think I'm so afraid of her nails becoming really long and her becoming really averse to nail trims in the way that copper did because he broke his nail a few times that I, anytime her nails, just, anytime I can see any nail beyond the quick, I'm like, I'm failing her.

And maybe I just need to lower my expectation and be like, it's okay if her nails are, she doesn't tippy tappy, like her nails don't touch the ground. But I'm just like, I can see nail beyond the quick. They're getting too long. Is that true, Emily? I'm not sure that's true. 

[00:33:50] Tiffany: What does your data tell you?

[00:33:52] Emily: Yeah. I a good question. Good question. We'll find out. We'll find out what my data tells me. Like how much do I actually have to trim her nails to keep to. If the goal of nail trims is protecting her musculoskeletal health, so her nails aren't so long that they are distorting the position of her joints, then no, I don't need to do this every day.

I'm, I'm anxious about cosmetics and I'm making my decision based on an unfounded fear that she's going to become like copper, even though I have no evidence for that. Not on the evidence that her nails are in any way impacting her musculoskeletal health.

Dang, you just gave me a an aha moment, Tiffany. Thank you for 

that. 

[00:34:38] Tiffany: Great job. Me?

[00:34:39] Emily: Yo, Tiffany, this is going in our team 

shout outs. 

[00:34:43] Tiffany: You're gonna get the scratch board out today. That's, that's what I'm gonna do.

[00:34:46] Emily: Amazing. So thanks for that aha moment. That's, that's huge. But yeah, I mean we've talked in previous episodes about the capital T versus kind of train as you go training, or, or Ellen has started charmingly calling it lower T training, which delights me beyond compare. I love that she, she calls it lower T training instead of train 

as you go because I enjoy the symmetry of capital T versus lower T training.

 But yeah, it doesn't have to look like a formal session to count. And I think that was a journey that I had to go on that like, I'm not a bad trainer just because I. Avoid capital T training sessions like a plague. Like I still teach all these skills because I just incorporate it into my day and like as these opportunities to arise, right?

Like if we're in a situation where I'm like, if this is a situation where you could do an undesirable behavior or I could, I could set you up to do the desirable behavior and reinforce you for that. So we're gonna do it. We're gonna do that. We're gonna choose the desirable behavior avenue. I'm gonna reinforce you.

It's going to be a single trial event, and then we're gonna move on with our day. And like that is how all of my animals learn most of their skills. And that is how when I was still seeing clients directly in person, I mean with, with clients directly, not through the team or through my, my mentees. That is how I set up most of their training plans too, as much as possible, because that is.

Far more sustainable for most people than I want you to spend 10 minutes a day doing all these repetitions, right?

[00:36:18] Tiffany: Well, yeah. And when you get those moments where, like

earlier today, PD was gonna go bark out the window and he looked out the window and I saw his body tense and his weight went forward and he went, but then he turned around on the bed and he looked at me.

I'm like, yeah, man, that's great. And I've always got treats beside my desk and I just threw 'em out in the hallway.

Like, that doesn't look like much to someone who hasn't experienced a, a dog who react, who reacts the way that, that he does. And we didn't get there by. Doing a lot of capital T training. We got there by doing exactly what I just did, which is keeping the food by my desk and encouraging him to what I say is, alright, man. Are you ready? You'll feel better. You'll feel better if you just go in the hall and stop staring at the dog out the window.

[00:37:15] Emily: exactly. It's just, you're, you're just harnessing these real world opportunities to practice healthier and more enriching responses. So that's the thing that I really like in proce, in, in addressing miley's guarding behaviors. I was like, okay, I'm gonna really pay attention to what I'm actually doing with her because I really, in the past, I've struggled to come up with like very concrete examples of what it looks like to do lower t or train as you go 

[00:37:46] Tiffany: Yeah, because you're not doing that plan where it's like you get the cheese and they're behind a barrier and you walk over so many times because like 

[00:37:55] Emily: Exactly. It's not even just time. It's like who has the bandwidth to keep that in their head as one of the things that they have to add to their schedule every day. Like I said, my fin app has been really good data for me about like what my capacity is to, to like follow daily routines. I have a, a hard limit of 11 things.

If I try to put a 12 thing, a 12 daily routine in my Finch app, something starts falling out. I, I, I have to skip something. So I know that about myself now is I have a capacity of 11 things as a part of my daily routine. self care and enrichment. I do more than 11 things every day, y'all, but Okay. But I mean, like that, that is my, my bandwidth.

That's my bandwidth for how much I can pay attention to. Beyond that, I start experiencing adherence, fatigue, and I can't maintain that habit long term. And I think that's the more, that's the bigger pain point. That ad adherence, fatigue is the bigger pain point for most people because most people do have 10 minutes a day.

They just don't have the bandwidth to pay attention to it and turn it into a habit and a part of their routine on top of everything else that is a part of their daily routine. Whereas with Miley, most of her gardening was happening in the evening, during or after dinner. And so, and I could always tell when she was gonna start because she like.

Like stands up and looks at copper and a little shoulders get tense. Like she 10 bunches are like, her shoulders are getting way too close to her ears. And me being a former yoga teacher is like, drop your shoulders away from your ears, baby. 

[00:39:29] Tiffany: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just take a breath.

[00:39:32] Emily: And, and so like I see those shoulders go up towards your ears and I can intervene men and call her away from copper, give her like a piece of whatever's on my dinner plate give her lots of love and attention. And, and then I ask her like, I'll lift the blanket. And I'll be like, do you wanna snug? And she'll go under the blanket and she'll curl up by my legs and she'll go to sleep.

She's a cranky, hormonal teenager. Like, she just gets cranky at copper. So like, that is what it looks like to do train as you go, or lower t training instead of, I didn't, I've done zero capital T training sessions with copper and Miley. I've done zero. Of like the typical counter conditioning techniques.

I've done zero trades, I've done zero place training. I didn't do any of that. All I did was anytime I see her shoulders go towards her ears, when she's looking at copper during or after dinner, I call her. To me, she gets usually more than one type of, of reinforcer. And then she gets an app, right?

[00:40:32] Tiffany: You just tag taught yourself, shoulders go up, snuggy time.

But then like the other thing about capital T training and giving somebody else this whole like complicated thing to do is there's another sentient being involved in that. And just like our dogs and the dog that you gave the example of is like that's the way that they're feeling about training on that particular day is out of your control.

[00:41:01] Emily: I like, I do think it's important for people un to understand reinforcer value and to be able to do preference tests and to see that, like if a learner's not responding to something, have you tried a higher value reinforcer? Have you tried a more salient or, or relevant reinforcer? Have you.

Like eliminated distractions in the environment. I'm not in any way saying that we don't need to do those things. Those things are very important. And also when you see a learner who has a like habitual response, no matter how high the reinforcer is, no matter how low the distraction is, and every session, they're like, this is my limit.

You need to honor that. You need to listen to that. That is not something that you need to work harder or try harder to train them out of their own preference, like just listen to their preference and honor it. I'm never gonna try to convince Milo that he really does want to do more than five trials of any given behavior.

I just need to find the magic reinforcer that's gonna change his mind about that, and I'm not interested in in doing that with Miley either. I have done multiple preference tests multiple times with her. I have a very clear picture of what she values. I also have a very clear picture of the context in which some things are more valuable than others.

I have done that labor, that labor is important, it should be done. And also I have a very, very solid history of her saying, I enjoy this once it's fun. Sometimes I enjoy it twice. It's fun. The third time, this is old news. I'm ready to move on to something else. So that's a good example of how to reduce expectations without reducing progress.

And in fact, the only reason that I can sometimes be bad and get away with doing four nails, even though I shouldn't, because the next day she's more hesitant to do it, is because I have done that work with her and she will tolerate more. Because I've done that work with her, but I'm not expecting that of either of us because that's not her preference.

And it does, and it's not necessary. So I really think this is about reframing from this isn't working to what would make this doable? Like what, what can we change about whatever it is that we're trying to attempt that would make it actually more doable? And y'all have listened to us hash out.

Like you, you don't have to have a, a simple, easy solution that you figure out right away. Sometimes it really is about like percolating and trying some different things and eventually figuring something out that works. So it, it can be an iterative process, but that is the, that's the mindset to get into is like, if this isn't working, what can we do to make it doable?

Okay, so we talked about like for when we're working with our own pets, how do you do the train as you go, or lower t training, you just fold it into what you're already doing for professionals, working with clients, what that looks like is use scaffolding, start smaller, ask your clients to do less find quick wins, celebrate these little micro successes.

Work as hard as you can to reduce the cognitive burden, like we talked about, like getting rid of as many of the capital t training plans as you possibly can without compromising your ability to reach your client's goal. And, and that's a really important part of it too, is like, okay, if what, if what I'm asking you to do isn't working?

Either you're trying it and it's, and you can't maintain the routine, or you're just not trying it at all. You're just like oping out of even trying it. Cool. That's really good information. How do we make this doable? What can we, what can we do like splitting approximations or giving you some quick wins, reducing our expectations. Can, what can we shift from capital T training to lower T training, right?

[00:45:09] Tiffany: Pay attention to when that goal shifts too, because maybe they're not even, maybe you gave them enough information and they've learned so much about, say, their dog that like what they thought they wanted to work on or what they thought the goal was is different now.

[00:45:27] Emily: Yeah, yeah, exactly like that is. Really important part of consulting is just because we started with a specific goal doesn't mean that that is still our goal. And a lot of times when we work with clients we'll start working towards a specific goal and then as we start giving them quick wins and some easier solutions and they start to be better at reading their pet's body language and we improve the relationship between them and their pet, we can circle back and be like, okay, this was our original goal.

Is this still your goal? And they're like, actually, I have a totally different goal now because I have a very different understanding of my pet and my relationship with them and what enrichment looks like and how to set up my environment. So now this is my new goal. And you're like, cool. That's a way easier goal.

Let's do that because that is way easier than our original goal.

It's just a good reminder that this belief that like if I cared enough, I would make it happened. Or if I was disciplined enough, I would be able to pull this off. That is a myth that is not true. The truth is no matter how much you care, if it's not doable, hearing more is not going to fix it. If it's not doable, more discipline is not going to fix it. And I think that's a thing that we really help a lot of our mentees with too, is like the rules in your brain about what counts as progress are too hard. They're not sustainable, they're not supporting your actual growth and your actual journey towards your goals.

Let's look at what sustainable growth looks like so that you first of all have the opportunity to grow, and secondly, are able to recognize when you are growing, 

[00:47:17] Tiffany: And also you don't burn out.

[00:47:18] Emily: burnout and helplessness are natural outcomes of trying and trying and trying and failing, and failing and failing, When every attempt to do it right, quote unquote, is met with failure. it's met with resistance or I don't know how else to say it. Like when every attempt fails, that's like the definition of helplessness, right? an escapable, aversive stimuli. No matter how much effort you put into something, it's always punished.

Helplessness happens, which I, I really do think that like a lot of burnout comes from helplessness or I think burnout and helplessness are really related. Burnout is a symptom of helplessness. Helplessness is a symptom of burnout. I don't know. There's a connection there is what I'm trying to say.

So how can you apply this in your life today? I would say, first of all, if you feel like you're white knuckling your way through something that's, that's, your sign, 

[00:48:12] Tiffany: Or if you stopped doing it.

[00:48:14] Emily: or you stopped doing it, or if you never started doing it, any of the above. Then the next step is to ask yourself, if I'm not doing it, what would make it doable?

And then try to redesign just one thing to better fit in your day-to-day life. Just one thing, just try one thing at a time. You don't need to overhaul your entire life, your entire business, your entire consulting skills, your entire enrichment plan, your entire routine, your entire self-care plan. You don't have to, you don't have to overhaul things. Just redesign one thing. See how that feels for you 

So here's some concrete examples of what that could look like. If you feel like you have to practice, recall with your dog 15 minutes a day, what would it, how would it change things for you if instead you were just like, every time you go outside with your dog, you practice, recall, that could, that could be an example, right?

Man, when I started in this field, it was a regular, regular expectation that clients would practice 30 to 60 minutes a day with their dogs. Wild. Fortunately we don't, that's just, I rarely hear anybody say that anymore, but that was like soup's common when I started. Okay. Here's another example.

If you feel like you have to write content for an hour every day and you like never write content or you like binge write once a month and you hate it so much and it takes so long that you just quit what would it look like to shift that to something like, what if you brain dump an idea that you get from a client call immediately after that call so that you've just got.

The ideas that you get throughout the day, right? Here's a great example from my life that looks a lot like that. I used to have a task for myself in Clickup to say like, send our social media manager wins from my different mentees from this week. And I would spend so much time going through my worksheets from the week trying to remember wins.

And a lot of times I'd be like, I don't even remember. I don't remember. I honestly like looking at this worksheet is not helping me. So I was spending a lot of time and not coming up with a lot of wins. And then I shifted that to a daily task and it's like at immediately after a coaching call, if I have a win, I just pop it into Clickup and suddenly I've been able to do it a lot more than I used to.

[00:50:46] Tiffany: I just use my notepad on my phone I may or may not remember what I meant by any of them, but like I'm also a professional writer. Just get your ideas down. Pick 'em up later.

[00:50:59] Emily: One of the most important things our publisher said to me when we first started writing the book was just get the clay on the wheel. And I was like, oh, brain dump. It doesn't, I don't have to like spit it out. This, this fully formulated, well articulated concept. I just have to like brain dump. 

[00:51:18] Tiffany: I'm barely articulated.

[00:51:20] Emily: Yeah. Yeah. Same. I basically just dump a bunch of words on a page and then I go back and I sculpt those words just like you would sculpt clay on a wheel. So that was, that was super helpful. So in summary, we just have to remember that doing less doesn't mean that you care less or you're less disciplined. It means that you're building systems that actually work for you, your pets, your partners, your family, your business, your clients, your students, the learners in your care, whoever they are, you're building systems that actually work and usually.

Simplicity is the hallmark. I, I don't wanna say that because over, over overly simplistic things are also common, and that can be harmful. But I would say streamlined systems are a hallmark of really being really successful systems. 

[00:52:20] Tiffany: Yeah, because growth mindset doesn't have to be like making things more complicated. Growth mindset can just be tweaking what you're doing and integrating what you've learned.

[00:52:33] Emily: And like we said earlier resting for a little bit and just continuing to practice what you've already got before trying to like, take on new stuff. 

Secondly, remember, if you aren't doing it, it's not doable. Sustainable change happens when we design for real life, not ideal life. Boom.

Mic drop.

Who has an ideal life?

Like zero people I know. Thirdly, look at one thing that's been on your, I should be doing this list for weeks and ask yourself, what would make that doable? Or in my case, look at that 12th item on my French app and ask myself what would make this doable?

[00:53:13] Allie: I hope you enjoy today's episode and if there's someone in your life who also needs to hear this, be sure to text it to them right now. If you're a pet parent looking for more tips on enrichment, behavior modification, and finding harmony with your pet, you can find us on Facebook and Instagram at Pet Harmony training. If you're a behavior or training professional dedicated to enrichment for yourself, your clients, and their pets, check us out on TikTok and Instagram at Pet Harmony Pro.

As always, links to everything we discussed in this episode are in the show notes. Thank you to Ellen Yoakum for editing this episode and making us sound good. Our intro music is from Penguin Music on Pixa Bay. Please rate, review, and subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts. That helps more pet lovers and professionals find us so they can bring enrichment into their world too.

Thank you for listening, and here's to harmony. 

[00:54:06] Tiffany: I feel sorry for Alan, for whatever this is gonna be.

[00:54:10] Emily: I feel sorry for Ellen two, except this is such a stark improvement on what our podcast recordings used to be, that I feel like this is probably still a win for her. Ellen, you can tell me otherwise, but I feel like I'm like less of a garbage dump. Garbage fire. Dumpster fire. There we go. I got

[00:54:29] Tiffany: Garbage dump. I don't know. I feel like hot trash. 

[00:54:31] Emily: trying to call myself a dumpster fire, but being too much of a dumpster fire, how to say that? 

[00:54:37] Tiffany: Everyone's fine. It's fine.